kester has a great series of posts as part of the via crucis 2007. the central issue he gets at is that in contrast with judas and paul, jesus resisted getting involved in power plays and strategies. the question he asks is whether the emerging church can resist the temptation which is a great question…
can the emerging church resist power plays?
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It’s very thought provoking.
I really appreciate the comment you wrote under [3]. I have been thinking along these lines for a while now. Where are the females? Emergent is very male dominated. Earlier today I was blogging about the anniversary of the abolition of slavery, in response to a story I’d read on BBC. It talked about everyone focusing on Wilberforce and not the black freedom fighters. Following this I was trying to think of those involved in emergent or new forms of church from other ethnicities, and to be honest I couldn’t think of anyone. How would the conversation be if all backgrounds and cultures were represented?
i think that the conversation might reflect who God is with a lot more resolution and focus, peace j
The women’s voices are out there. I’m working on a book for Church Publishing Company here in the US that’s due November 2007. This will be a series of Studs Terkel style interviews of Christian leaders, who are seeking ways to reach those for whom church is not in their vocabulary. Most of the voices are from the emerging streams, though there are some other views in the mix. Of the 32 interview subjects (six are from the UK), 14 were female (two were women of color). Also, I found an emergent Latino group that I listed in my resource database.
The Q is how to bring all these voices to the table in a holistic manner? I, for one, stay away from anything having to do with “women’s issues,” as to me this marginalizes the debate in the same way the church later dismissed the role of women such as Mary Magdalene. How do we recapture that radical hospitality of Christ? What does it mean for us to be one body in Christ?
A problem here in the States is the marketing of Emergent Church (TM). Simply put, there are some who are not willing to relinquish their turf (and hence source of income) as a speaker/writer on this topic so that others can be let into the dialogue. How do we discourage this kind of behavior, while giving kuddos to those who have a more egalitarian view here?
For example, I am aware of some of Brian McLaren’s international efforts to build bridges that give me hope. He’s been very supportive of my work and for that I am grateful. We need other leaders to be bridge builders.
i agree becky, the women’s voices are there – we are extremely strong in missional ministry – for the most part though i think our conversation is about different things, different ways of knowing and making meaning and therefore remains unrecognised – and over the years i think it has been pretty much constant amidst all the ups and downs, ins and outs of the mainstream – the thing is, most of the women i meet in missional ministry are not that interested in having a seat at the table, joining the intellectual conversation, writing books, contributing to the academic melting pot – i’m not even sure it has to do with gender really – i think it is more an issue about how we learn – i think some of it might have more to do with the age old divide between theory and practice, between the academic and the practitioner – i for one would welcome a more holistic, more inclusive vocabulary that helps connect people around that issue – peace, j
Excellent points – Many of the men and women I meet who are in the trenches so to speak are turned off by this divide between theory and practice. (That’s why I am so attracted to say Henri Nouwen’s writings that came about as a result of his experiences with the Daybreak community for instance.)
In particular, these people would like a voice but the thought of participating in an spiritual or theological “smackdown” type of an invigorating intellectual debate doesn’t appeal to them. It seems that the requirements to participate in this type of dialogue are at least two of the 4 Ps (published, PhD, pastor/planter and the fourth is self-evident). Unfortunately this is the kind of communication that gets expressed via the blogosphere, books, academic conferences and the like. So, this type of a discourse tends to dominate the discussion and garners the most attention.
As a result, some really exciting expressions don’t get heard – I feel it’s my job as a writer to help bring these stories to the surface.
Becky, your book sounds really interesting. When I wrote asking where the emergent women were – what I meant was that there are not many at the forefront, if you want to put it “famous” women i.e. mention Brian McLaren, Leonard Sweet, Andrew Jones etc and most people know who you are talking about. The discussion on the surface does seem to be more male, white, middle class dominated, and it would be great to hear other peoples expressions – you are right, there are some exciting things out there. Julie, I agree, women do express themselves differently. I would love to see more holistic and inclusive vocabulary used.
I don’t think “women’s issues” should be brought into the debate like they have in the past in terms of ordained women etc, that’s not what I meant at all. I think women really complement men, as we think quite differently, so in some senses that would make the conversation more “whole”. As a women, I’d really like to hear more from other women about their experiences with church/new expressions of church, how they perceive the future to be etc.
have to say thanks jonny for allowing us to post on this thread on your blog as if you weren’t party to the conversation (how rude am i !)
becky – i’m glad that you are going to tell a rather different version of the story and i wish you well with that – may it be the first of many dangerous expressions because we need to find lots of ways to creatively hear diverse voices
lyn – i agree wholeheartedly with your comments about the rather male orientation of the dialogue – it highlights for me how much we are struggling in this emerging conversation to speak about the unspeakable and describe the unimaginable because we are still trying to do it using the language of modernity (which let’s face it was seeped in paternalistic rationality) – language itself is power and i think that part of trying to incorporate new and diverse voices will need to include growing a new, inclusive, holistic language through which to engage in conversation about the things we know, see and experience in the emerging church
peace, j
Jonny is one of the people I interviewed for the book, so he’s in the dialogue. I chose the interview format as it struck me as the best way to let each person’s unique voice come through. I see my role here as a hostess of a salon, who issued the invites. A lot of the fun is bringing together a range of people and hearing them all speak — some voices are well known (so there is some traditional voices being expressed) and others (to pardon the pun) are emerging. I added some voices who aren’t in the emergent stream per se to expand the depiction of “church.”
Also, the book is geared towards worship leaders in mainline churches, a group that is pretty new to this dialogue. Kewl.
Have you come across the Emerging Women Blog yet? It’s encouraging to hear women’s voices speaking out loud and proud there. Julie Clawson is someone to watch I think. And Jemila Monroe as well as Lydia who writes for The Ooze.
I write for The Ooze where Lydia is my editor. Just plugged into Emerging Women – they reposted a piece I did on God’s Politics about an Easter service here in NYC called Transmission. Great recommendations – thanks.
thanks for all the comments and conversation. i am just reading an emergent book – emergent manifesto – that i got asked to review. i really like sally morgenthaler’s chapter a lot on leadership in a flattened world if you get the chance to look…